017b יש בקרבנות פרק שני תמורה יז ע"ב - YESH BEKORBONOS CHAPTER TWO TEMURAH

Shmuel said to him: perhaps this Tanna also holds that whenever a thing is not fit for its own body^[1], the sanctity of the body does not take effect on it.

הכי גרסינן מיתיבי ר' אליעזר כו' הך גרסי' ברישא והדר הך כל הקדשים שנעשו טרפה: אמר לך שמואל - R. Eliezer holds that whenever a thing is not fit for its body, etc.; and I say as the Sages do.

דלמא - Which Tanna is this? It is R. Eliezer's, who holds that originally they would redeem [the offspring].

End of the chapter Yesh BeKorbanot

Chapter Three: Eilu Kodashim (These Are the Sacrifices)

These are the sacrifices whose offspring and substitutes are like them: the offspring of a peace-offering, and its substitute, their offspring and the offspring of their offspring until the end of all generations, are peace-offerings, and require laying of hands, libations, and the waving of the breast and the thigh.

Since he taught their offspring, and the offspring of their offspring, until the end of all generations, why does he need to say this?

מתני' אלו וכיון דתנא ולדן וולד וולדן ל"ל - In the Mishnah, 'these'. Since it taught 'offspring and the offspring of offspring', why [say] it? To teach it until the end of the world.

Our Tanna heard that R. Eliezer^[2] says: the offspring of a peace-offering^[3] is not offered as a peace-offering.

שמעיה לר"א דאמר - In the Mishnah: the offspring of a peace-offering is not offered, but must die.

And our Tanna answered him: it is not only about their offspring, which I do not concede; even until the end of the world I do not concede to you.

From where do we know this? As our Rabbis taught: (Leviticus 3)^[4] 'male', to include the offspring.

זכר - 'Male': concerning peace-offerings, as it says (Leviticus 3:1) 'and if his offering is a sacrifice of peace-offerings'. It should have written 'if from the herd, he shall offer an unblemished one'; why [say] 'male or female'? Only for a derivation.

Is this not a kal vachomer? If a substitute, which is not a growth of the consecrated animal, is offered, then the offspring, which is a growth of the consecrated animal, should surely be offered. You could say: the substitute applies to all sacrifices, but the offspring does not apply to all sacrifices, and so the offspring is not offered, since it does not apply to all sacrifices.

קריבה - As is derived below from the female.

בכל הקדשים - Individual sacrifices.

ולד אינו נוהג בכל הקדשים - Because a burnt offering and a guilt-offering are males.

The verse says 'male', to include the offspring, and 'female', to include the substitute^[5].

I would have only the substitute of unblemished^[6][7] animals and the offspring of unblemished animals. The substitute of blemished animals: from where?

וולד תמימים - Because the mother is unblemished.

The verse says: 'if male', to include the offspring of blemished animals; 'if female', to include the substitute of blemished animals.

אם - To include.

Rav Safra^[8] said to Abaye: but I reverse it, and it is logical: from the place where the substitute of unblemished animals was included, the substitute of blemished animals was included too.

ואיפוך אנא - 'If male' includes the substitute of blemished animals, and 'if female' includes the offspring of blemished animals.

ממקום שנתרבתה - From the female the substitute of unblemished animals was included; therefore the 'if' next to it includes the substitute of blemished animals, and not the 'if' next to 'male'.

He said to him: I am not saying to reverse it, whether male or female. I am saying the whole verse.

כוליה קרא - 'Male' includes the substitute, with its own 'if' for the substitute of blemished animals; 'female' includes the offspring, with its own 'if' for the offspring of blemished animals.

Say: 'male' includes the substitute, and 'female' includes the offspring.

He said to him: 'offspring' is a masculine word and implies the male; 'substitute' is a feminine word and implies the female. For what ruling is this?

לשון זכר משמע - Therefore the inclusion is derived from the male.

למאי הלכתא - For the ruling: the sanctity of these offspring of blemished animals, since their mothers are not fit to be offered.

Shmuel^[9] said: it is offered, and this is according to R. Eleazar.

ואליבא דרבי אלעזר - Who says in the Mishnah: if one set aside a female for a burnt offering and it gave birth, its offspring is offered as a burnt offering, even though its mother is not fit. Here too they are offered; and it was necessary to teach this even though the mother is unfit.

Lest you say: when R. Eleazar said [that the offspring is offered], it was about a burnt offering^[10], because the name burnt offering rests on its mother; but these offspring are not offered.

דמהו דתימא - Lest you say: R. Eleazar said there about a burnt offering, since the name burnt offering rests on its mother, meaning that even though she herself was not offered, her sanctity is not lost; for we find a female burnt offering, such as a bird's burnt offering, where birds have no distinction of male and female.

אבל גבי וולדות - But regarding offspring: peace-offerings of blemished animals, for there is no peace-offering name on their mothers; we never find a blemished animal offered as a peace-offering, since there are no bird peace-offerings. Therefore they are not offered.

This teaches us.

Bar Pada said: they graze^[11], and this is according to all opinions.

דברי הכל - For even the Sages agree that they are at least holy, they graze, and we do not say they are ordinary^[12]; for we say also regarding a female burnt offering that its offspring grazes.

Rava said: they are offered, and this is according to R. Eleazar.

Rav Pappa said: they graze, and this is according to all opinions.

And this Tanna derives it from here: (Deuteronomy 12:26) 'Only your holy things which you have', these are the substitutes; 'and the offspring of them', these are the offspring.

'You shall take and come': I might think one should bring them into the chosen place^[13], and withhold water and food from them, so that they die.

יכול יכניסנו לבית הבחירה וימנע מהן כו' - Since 'you shall take and come' is already fulfilled [by the sin-offering].

The verse says: (Deuteronomy 12:27) 'And you shall make your burnt offerings, the flesh and the blood'. As you treat a burnt offering, so you treat a substitute; as you treat peace-offerings, so you treat the offspring of peace-offerings and of substitutes.

ועשית עולותיך ודם זבחיך ישפך וגו' - (Deuteronomy 12:27). This verse is adjacent to 'only your holy things'.

You treat a substitute as you treat peace-offerings, and you treat the offspring of peace-offerings and the substitute likewise.

I might think that all sacrifices are the same, and so [the substitute and offspring] of all of them.

The verse says 'only', the words of R. Yishmael.

R. Akiva says: it is not needed. The verse says: 'it is a guilt-offering, it is offered', and its substitute is not offered.

The Tanna said: 'You shall take and come': I might think one should bring it into the chosen place.

From where can this be derived? Since we learn the five sin-offerings, these are offered.

מנא תיתי - It might occur to one that they die, since the verse says 'your burnt offerings'. Since we learn that five sin-offerings die, two of them, the offspring and the substitute of a sin-offering, [are the case]; by implication the offspring and substitute of peace-offerings are not brought, for we learned it only about a sin-offering.

Lest you say: the five sin-offerings^[14] die anywhere, and these die in the chosen place.

This teaches us.

The Tanna said: I might think that all sacrifices are the same too.

יכול אף כל הקדשים - Its offspring and its substitute would also be offered.

The verse says: 'only your holy things'.

ת"ל רק - And further on it explains: this 'only' excludes the offspring; all these are exclusions.

Whose offspring is it?

If it is the offspring of a burnt offering, then the animal is male and cannot bear young^[15].

And if it is the offspring of a sin-offering^[16], we learned that it is destined to die.

והא בהא תליא - This is an objection that [the Gemara] raises.

Tosafot

לא מיבעיא בוולדות דלא מודינא לך אלא אפילו עד סוף העולם לא מודינא לך - [The Mishnah says 'to the end of the world'] 'It is not only regarding offspring which I do not concede; even until the end of the world I do not concede to you.' If you ask: why not teach 'until the end of the world' alone, without 'offspring and the offspring of offspring'? We answer: the Mishnah teaches both, not one only. It is a question on a deed text, not on the Mishnah's wording; in the Mishnah there is no need to be so exact.

נקבה לרבות התמורה - 'And the female, to include the substitute': although it is written (Leviticus 27:10) 'and its substitute shall be holy', a verse is needed to include the substitute for offering. If you ask: why here is a verse needed to include offering, when for first-born and tithe the Torah writes an exclusion; here offspring and substitute are not excluded? We answer: since an exclusion is written for first-born and tithe, a verse is needed here to include.

דאיכא שם עולה על אמו - 'That the name burnt offering rests on its mother': Rashi explains that a female can belong to a burnt offering, since we find a female burnt offering in the bird's burnt offering, where there is no distinction of male and female. But regarding offspring of blemished peace-offerings, there is no sacred name on their mothers, since a blemished animal is never offered as a peace-offering, and there are no bird peace-offerings. Rabbeinu Meir explains: 'the name burnt offering rests on its mother' means that she has sanctity of the body, so the offspring itself is offered; but for blemished animals there is no sanctity of the body at all, so the offspring are not offered and must graze.

אי דעולה זכר הוא - 'If it is the offspring of a burnt offering, it is male and cannot bear young': and if it is of a substitute, surely it is offered. And if it is of a guilt-offering, we learned that it goes to graze, and the Gemara could have said 'male and cannot bear' as for burnt offering; instead it prefers a different argument. If you ask: according to R. Tam, who says a halakhah to Moses from Sinai that anything which dies as a sin-offering is offered as a guilt-offering, why not explain it as a guilt-offering? We answer: here he cannot, since it is clear to him that it is not offered as a guilt-offering.

Notes

1. 1. Sanctity of the body (kedushat haguf): the holiness that makes the animal itself fit for the altar. Sanctity of value (kedushat damim) is different: it applies to money given for a consecrated item.
2. 2. R. Eliezer: a Tanna who holds that the offspring of a peace-offering is not offered as a peace-offering, but must die.
3. 3. Offspring (vlad): an animal born of a consecrated animal. According to the Mishnah, the offspring and the offspring of the offspring keep the status of peace-offerings.
4. 4. Leviticus 3 is the chapter on the peace-offering; it says 'male or female'.
5. 5. Substitute (temurah): when a consecrated animal is exchanged for another, the substitute also becomes holy (Leviticus 27:10).
6. 6. Unblemished (tamim): an animal without a defect, fit for the altar.
7. 7. Blemished (ba'al mum): an animal with a defect, which may not be offered on the altar (Leviticus 22).
8. 8. Rav Safra: a Babylonian Amora (general knowledge).
9. 9. Shmuel: a Babylonian Amora of the first generation of Amoraim (general knowledge).
10. 10. Burnt offering (olah): a sacrifice wholly burnt on the altar, none of it eaten.
11. 11. To graze (le-re'iyah): the animal is left to graze in the field, not offered, until it dies or becomes blemished.
12. 12. Ordinary (chullin): not holy. Rashi says these are not ordinary, since they still carry sanctity.
13. 13. Chosen place (bet habechirah): the place God chose for His name, the Temple in Jerusalem.
14. 14. The five sin-offerings: the Gemara's earlier discussion holds that these five die rather than being offered when unfit (to verify against earlier pages).
15. 15. Able to bear young: a male cannot bear offspring, so the question of its offspring does not arise.
16. 16. Sin-offering (chatat): an offering brought for an inadvertent sin.